Why Does the Chief of Leonine, Germany's Leading Independent Film and TV Company, Back Skydance? 'David Ellison and Ynon Kreiz Are a Very Strong Team'

Fred Kogel, Managing Director of Leonine Studios, Germany's leading independent distribution and production company, is pleased with the merger of Paramount and Warner Bros. Discovery, now part of Skydance. Variety spoke with him about how this merger is likely to affect the film and TV landscape in German-speaking regions. One of the commitments that […]

Fred Kugel, CEO of Leonine Studios, Germany's leading independent distribution and production company, is delighted with the merger of Paramount and Warner Bros. Discovery, now part of Skydance. Variety spoke to him about how the merger is likely to affect the film and television landscape in German-speaking regions.

One of the commitments Skydance CEO David Ellison made while trying to merge was to produce more than 30 films a year. Kugel is confident that Ellison will do just that. Related Stories 'Pete' and 'It's All His Fault' Among the Winners of the Inaugural Eastersel Disability Arts and Culture Awards

"What gives me confidence that the number [of films] will be delivered is that David Ellison comes from a content background and has produced great films in the past with Skydance," says Kugel. He is a businessman and a creative guy. He loves business and loves making movies. Popular in Variety

Kugel points to Ellison's record as a producer as evidence to support this. "Knowing the production business and knowing the theater business, I know what it means to increase the number of theatrical films," he says. "It's a tough feat to achieve. You need long-term development. You need enough projects in the pipeline to increase that number. So, I'm optimistic with him and the management that they will deliver the number of films."

Given how impressive Skydance is, does Kugel have any concerns about Skydance being alive?

"I think Skydance is a group with fantastic assets, IPs and facilities," he says. "I have full confidence in the people who run Skydance. I admire David Ellison because he's an entrepreneur and has proven [his abilities] in the past. I think David Ellison and Ynon Cryze are a very strong team. I also have a lot of respect for Ynon. It takes a lot of vision, strength and courage, and a great team to achieve what they've had, but it takes a great team. It's a great job to be a part of. And I As the managers that they are, I have full confidence that they and their teams can handle it, so I'm very positive.

Kugel sees opportunities for Leonine to produce films for Skydance. "If there's a compelling IP that we can produce, it can be natural to work with another distributor," he says. "This is what we have done in the past."

Leonine can also produce TV drama series for Skydance. "We're already doing good business with HBO Max as a production unit," he says. "So for us, it's always interesting to be a local producer of premium content and align with a studio like Skydance, and of course we can help."

"Overall, with production, I think it's a good development. If you come into it from the TV production side, I think it's a positive thing for us. I mean, we're doing very good business with HBO Max in Germany," he adds.

"HBO Max [in Germany] started at the beginning of the year, and just two weeks ago we launched our first German original with HBO Max, 'Four Blocks Zero' - the prequel to our hugely successful TNT series 'Four Blocks.' This is a great production by our banner Wiedemann & Berg Television. It's a very good collaboration, and in addition we presented a production from the Beatz brothers - "Klengold", the first documentary commissioned by HBO Max in Germany. I see them as a major force in the German startup market.

“Local German productions are crucial for all streamers and broadcasters to build long-term commitment from German audiences. Germany is the largest television market in Europe and one of the most important markets in the world. And as a content powerhouse, with strong HBO Max and Paramount+ services, Skydance has the power to invest.

The 30-plus films a year coming from Skydance could be seen as increasing competition for the leonine distribution business, but Kugel doesn't see it that way.

“For me, having been in the distribution business for a long time, distribution has always been very competitive. Therefore, this is not important news for us."

"We are a very competitive local distributor trying to be on par with the international giants, so we are used to a lot of competition. I think every good film that enters the German market helps the German market and the theater market in general.

I don't see this as a major problem. I think as long as the movies are of high quality - and that's what I expect - it's good for the market. And I mean, we're seeing a big trend, especially in Germany, where the top 20 to 25 films of the year make up the vast majority of the year's business. And you only need to have 2 or more 5 years of best movies. That goes for everybody: Warner, Paramount, Universal—so, as long as there's good competition, we've got to face it.

At Leonine, we are strong supporters of the theatrical release market, and if anyone in the business has such a commitment, I'd be very happy indeed.

So, our goal is to make the right movies that will bring people to the theaters. "I think that with David Ellison and his team's plans to increase volume, make quality films and make films that appeal to audiences, we're perfectly aligned on that."

So, is it the quality, not the quantity, of Skydance films?

"Yes, it's the quality. But in the end, I think in most cases the right films find their way to the market, and that's why I'm answering it from German. You have to see that out of about 650 films released in Germany every year, at least 200 are German, so 450 are international. So, if 10 more international films were to make it to theaters, and if they were good films, It was good for cinemas.

"It's a busy market for me anyway and finding release dates is the hardest thing for our distribution team as we support films to find their way to audiences. We definitely see in the German market that if we have strong films, other films will benefit because people will go to the cinema afterwards. For me, the worst case scenario is that we have to have 50 international films and we have 20 international films. Films, which is often a problem, especially with German productions, so for me it's not about whether we have 10 more films or 10 less films, and if they attract an audience, that's good for all of us.

There may be an opportunity for Leonin to distribute Paramount and Warner Bros. films in German-speaking countries.

"That could be a possibility," Kugel says. "We buy at least 25 international films and sometimes we make an international studio film and release it in Germany." "I mean, we do, but usually it doesn't happen if a big studio in Germany has a big distribution. Warner Bros. did that - because then they can release it themselves and they don't need us. But sometimes this happens."

Kugel says having a merged Paramount+/HBO Max streaming group has advantages.

In the end, I always say that if we have strong partners, it is good for the whole business. So for Leonine, it's good to have a strong Skydance group in the German market, because we can do business with both services. I think in our competitive market, the launch of Paramount+ will strengthen it and Paramount+ may ultimately become a stronger partner under the Skydance banner - at least in the coming years. It is too early to predict a long-term strategy. But this is not possible in our business anyway.

When it comes to broadcasters, the competition increases, as a strong HBO Max and a strong Paramount+ are stronger competitors against other broadcasters than under separate roofs. For example, if they increase the number of movies to more than 30 movies, more movies will be on their platforms. We still don't know what will happen in the end. And those who want to produce great content and get licenses, so, to me, that's a good thing.

Leonine has an advantage over other independents because it is part of a larger group called Mediawan, led by Pierre-Antoine Kapton, which also includes Plan B.

"Of course there are benefits, and you have to differentiate between distribution and production. So, we collaborate on production in many ways, because we are part of the Mediavan group, and some of our production companies work closely with the production companies in the Mediavan group. For example: when we produced and released a very successful German film called 'Weekend Rebels', it was noticed by Plan B, and together we developed a US version with Plan B, which has now gone directly to Apple. It's a remake. So, these are very interesting opportunities that Pierre Kapton and I talk about in non-fiction and how we can better join forces.

When it comes to distribution, I think it's a different business because distribution is very different from market to market.

We constantly talk about possible future collaborations on films: if Madiavan has a successful French film, we talk about distributing it in Germany.

"It's good that Leonin, as one of Germany's biggest distributors, is in the Mediavan group. It's interesting to look at any film that comes from this group to see if we can release it or work for Germany, Austria and Switzerland."

Kugel warns that if Warner Bros. and Paramount want to bring more production business to Germany, they will find that the incentive for German production is not as attractive as it could be.

"We're not there yet. I want Germany to eventually be a place where we can benefit from American studios producing more projects in Germany. why It's easy: We don't have a tax credit system here that matches the standards of other European countries or possible future US tax credits under the new plan.

"This is the missing link for Germany to really compete with other European territories that have tax credits."